And these fraudsters will keep coming at you. And they will get faster and wiser and smarter. But to be honest, I didn't know all the things that could have happened to me until actually I'd experienced them. So it's a massive warning to anyone, you know, whether you're a consumer or a business person, or you have a business and you own a business, or you've got a business partnership, or whatever it is, just make sure you're vigilant about everything.

Don't think that you know somebody, because you might not know them as well. You know, fraud, fraudsters can have lots of different faces and guises. It might be a stranger, like your podcast, but it also might be somebody that you know, so just be really, really careful out there. Reputations take years to build up and it takes a second to destroy.

We are at the station in where the market is making a shift. And this is an interesting time. It's great for us to be part of that shift. And I think we're really seeing it where you know, US regulators pushing for fraud today email integration for Model Management for how do you take the unknown risk the ethical All parts have all those false positives that are being generated.

So it's a great shift where the market needs to move away from the old school: I've seen a fraud so now I think I know all fraudsters to, I've seen a good customer now I know what a good customer looks like.

That's a great conversation that we want to be part of. And we want to hopefully lead but definitely be an active member.

The challenge, of course, is that people forget the answers to those questions, and also a motivated fraudster can go ahead and find the answer in many cases through different methods. And you do actually see that in some cases, you get organisations like Equifax, that can go a little bit deeper, they can do what's called dynamic knowledge based authentication and maybe they can look at your bank statements and ask you have you done a transaction for this amount on a certain day? Or how much do you pay against your mortgage each month, etc. and that's a little bit better.

But ultimately, people often don't get those questions right, especially when it's on the spot.

So the approach we took was to say, what is something that you should know, that you should always know you'll never forget, that we can present to you that isn't just memorable, but it's also frictionless or very easy, and in some cases, enjoyable for you to do. And we took this concept of, okay, if you live at a certain place, or you know, a certain area, then why don't we go ahead and grab different images from that area. And we're talking Google Street View images, in many cases, these are images that aren't easily searchable, you'd have to walk around and try and get to know a place if you're going to do it yourself.

To authenticate a document is just one step of the entire digital identity verification. The next step is to identify if the person was a live person, no, the liveness detection to compare the person against the document. There are some industries or some financial institutions that ask more than that, for example, proof of residence, you know, you can upload a document, we can authenticate any type of document, like a utility bill or bank statement to make sure that the address that is on that document is your residence address, in order to do any business now.

Or if you want to open an account in United States, and you say that you are here in Miami, you are a Florida resident. It's not only that you are a USA citizen, but you need to prove that you are a Florida resident. So we can authenticate the proof of address, we can authenticate any taxpayer document like Social Security or bat at this point, you know, it can be as simple as just do one step simple one step like for the car rentals.

And what we shouldn't forget is that, you know, the banks don't want fraud to occur. They don't go looking for that. And they're spending huge amounts of money to defend and protect against it. And trying to balance that with making sure that the service they provide to customers is convenient and easy because you just talked about the frustration of being stopped from getting access to something when that happens, they don't want to inconvenience you, or they also don't want you to be a victim of fraud. We shouldn't forget. And it sounds like I'm a massive supporter of banks, and I am to some degree, but I often read articles and I think the article is completely ignoring the fact behind all of this there's a bad guy, there's a fraudster who's gone out and committed fraud, committed deception. They've taken money out of that, or whatever it might be, the bank didn't ask for that don't want that. I'm just trying to protect against it.